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lakeridgeresident View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lakeridgeresident Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Sep 2006 at 3:12pm
sluDgE,
Those of us who have done the research know that overly successful HOT lanes have already charged HOV-3 vehicles. In california on SR 91, HOVs pay half what SOVs pay in the HOT lanes. That is reality.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n/a Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2006 at 10:02am
sludge, by the time they say carpoolers will pay, it will be a done deal, too late, finito, end of the line, all she wrote! BTW, the fee schedule will not come from VDOT. If it did, we may have some input. Fluor will set the prices based on a business case to recapture and profit from their investment in constructing the lanes.

Check previous posts on this forum that list the proposed fee schedule for your gate-to-gate tolls.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SpongeBob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Sep 2006 at 10:05am
SluDge, you haven't done enough research.

Just because current law says that HOV-3 will be free, does not mean that laws cannot be changed.

Even IF HOV-3 remains free forever, the proposed changes to the lanes (bottlenecks at each end, over a dozen new entrances and exits, tolls for using the road in the middle of the night, reduced safety, and so on,) should be enough to cause you to oppose it.

But the ultimate argument is simple fairness.

Most people (probably you) won't be able to afford to commute on these lanes solo. Toll roads are inherently unfair. They create a special, privileged, elite level of public service available not to those doing something for the common good (carpoolers and yes, hybrid owners) but only to the wealthy.

I have no problem with someone building a brand new road, on their own dime, and charging a toll for its use. But I have a real hard time with changing a publicly built road into a privately owned facility that enriches a corporation, encourages solo commuting, and benefits only the well-off.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote sluDgE Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 2006 at 12:51pm
Here's how it goes in California:

Q: When can I use the 3+ Carpool Lane?
A: Effective May 19, 2003, when you travel on the Express Lanes with 3 or more people in your vehicle, you can use the 3+ Lane and you will travel toll-free, except when traveling Eastbound, Monday through Friday between the hours of 4:00 p.m. and 6:00 p.m. During that peak time, when traveling through the 3+ Carpool Lane you will receive a 50% discount on the posted toll. This policy also applies to individuals on a motorcycle.
If you have a Standard Plan, Convenience Plan, or Express Club account, on days when you have fewer than 3 occupants in your car, please stay in one of the lanes marked “Toll Lanes” as you travel through the toll zone.
As a reminder, California State Law requires motorists traveling on the 91 Express Lanes, whether traveling alone or with others, to have a Transponder properly mounted on their vehicle, and a valid FasTrak account. This law is enforced by the California Highway Patrol and can carry fines up to $500. So please be sure your account is always in good standing and your transponder is properly mounted in your vehicle. We want your commute to be fast, safe, and reliable each time to travel the 91.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NoSUV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 2006 at 1:01pm
Sounds like they have an enforcement method, too - perhaps Sponge doesn't have his facts right.

91 requires you to register the vehicle tags with the transponder. I wonder if that's so they can use video technology to capture the tags of violators - either those in the carpool lane illegally or those in the toll lane without any transponder. They could do like DC and just send the owner of the vehicle the ticket.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote SpongeBob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Sep 2006 at 3:09pm
Apples and orangutans, NoSUV, apples and orangutans.

SR-91 is a four-lane (i.e. non-reversing) ten mile long custom-built toll road that hasn't lived up to the financial promises its creators made.

There is ONE entrance and ONE exit going in each direction. There is ONE tolling point. Carpools ARE charged during rush hour. So are motorcycles.

http://www.91expresslanes.com/learnabout/snapshot.asp

Actually, HOV-3 is enforced by diverting the carpools into a special lane at the ONE tollbooth. Per Wikipedia: "The carpool rules are enforced by a special video camera near the toll transceiver array or "booth" at the halfway point of the road. The camera room is occasionally staffed by a live person, and tapes are reviewed, to ensure that only carpoolers or other permitted vehicles get to travel for free or get the discount."

Tonight from 4-6 PDST, it will cost $0.85/mile to use the toll road, which I know because they do not use variable pricing, but instead go through a process like an electric utility rate increase -- publicly. Our toll roads won't have that public review of the pricing structure. They will jack the price up as high as needed to keep the lanes free-flowing.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NoSUV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Sep 2006 at 12:07pm
Sponge - it's 2 lanes each direction. Division made from regular lanes by first big white lines and as you get closer to the toll point, tall cones.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n/a Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Sep 2006 at 3:18pm
Sure and lucky dogs like me will get off with a $19.80 toll each way.

Aren't you lucky you don't have to deal with these lanes at all! Your commute from LRT to the Navy yard will be a breeze when all those former HOV commuters are dumped on to the side streets and non-HOV lanes. NOT! Wait, you thought they would keep the high-bred exemption. Not likely.

Wait, if you don't use the HOV lanes, and you don't slug, you don't carpool, and you don't use mass transit, why are you here? Agitator? Mole? Political activist? Spy? Lobbist for hybrid manufacturers? Hmmmmmm, TROLL!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MDC Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Sep 2006 at 10:22am
There's also the factor that HOV cars will not even be let on if it reaches capacity. All access will be cut of at that point, according to the developer in one of the meetings.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n/a Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Nov 2006 at 12:20pm
I keep seeing this headline, and each time I shudder with fear. How will we all get to work when we are forced to pay these ransoms?

SOV hybrids and HOV carpoolers/slugs need to realize that we will all be affected! MDC is correct here; when the load:capacity ratio reaches the threshold (to the congestion point that we are already reaching in am/pm rush hour), and the "system" realizes that it is "losing" money to HOVs, we will be forced to pay or we will be kicked off!

We have been sold out by our elected officials who are dodging their fiduciary responsibilities to balance their budgets, and instead they are shedding the financial obligations of highway maintenance by selling the "revenue/profit rights" to contractors. I thought our property tax dollars were already paying for highway maintenance! If not, then where are our taxes going? I thought our local politicians were supposed to be working in our best interest! Why then are these taxpayer pick-pocketing shell games being pushed through?

WE WILL ALL PAY!
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