Go Yellow

Ethanol from corn isn't the answer. Ethanol from discarded cellulose material will be the answer. It will be much cheaper and the research right now is going to make it possible. Corn ethanol isn't all that efficient, but there are a couple of researchers out there that grossly overstate the energy cost to produce it. They probably get their research money from oil companies.

The comment about not making vehicles flex fuel capable is short sighted. The infrastructure isn't there for only using ethanol, biodiesel, etc. Keeping the vehicles flex fuel capable speeds their adoption. The way to keep them using the renewable fuel is to price it lower than petro. Unfortunately, that would be accomplished by taxing petro products higher and politicians are too chicken#$%! to do what needs to be done. They can't get past the short terms costs to see the long term benefits.

If I were to buy a hybrid, I'd get clean fuel plates. Can anyone tell me where the clean fuel station is? Since gasoline isn't a clean fuel, hybrids must be fueling up at some secret location only disclosed to those who purchase a hybrid. Those hybrids I see at the gas station must be purchasing a newspaper.
Hybrids on the HOV burn just as much gasoline as any four cylinder engine. Take a look at their MPG stats listing highway mileage LOWER than city mileage. This is because the hybrid technology works best in stop and go traffic. Get in the main lanes and get the most out of your investment! Go Green [xx(]

NoSUV,
Don't try the SMUG stuff with me! Here are some MPG stats off of a hybrid web site. http://www.hybridcars.com/mileage.html
Notice how the highway mileage is lower (in all but a few cases). Also take a look at those terrible EPA estimates listed for the SUV's (clean fuel hybrids). Once you're done, look at this site http://www.greenercars.com/byclass.html to see autos that perform better than hybrids but don't receive a clean fuel designation. I guess the clean fuel designation has more to do with having a hybrid tag and nothing to do with fuel economy and emissions.
Honda Insight: City 61 Highway 68
Toyota Prius: City 60 Highway 51
Honda Civic: City 48 Highway 51
Toyota Camry: City 43 Highway 37
Honda Accord: City 30 Highway 37
Ford Escape (2wd): City 36 Highway 31
Ford Escape (4wd): City 33 Highway 29
Mercury Mariner: City 33 Highway 29
Toyota Highlander (2wd): City 33 Highway 28
Toyota Highlander (4wd): City 31 Highway 27
Lexus RX 400h: City 31 Highway 27
Lexus GS 450h: City 25 Highway 28
These figures represent EPA test numbers, which are commonly 10 - 20 percent higher than real-world fuel economy for hybrid and conventional vehicles.

I'm not against hybrid technology, I'm against using the technology as a way to bypass a system that is designed to move more people with less vehicles.

NoSUV, if you want to make a FAIR comparison, hybrids do not run on electric power; they run on a combination of a gas engine and "stored" electric power that was generated by a gas engine (and a small % from the intertia generated by your brakes, created by the forward momentum caused by your gas engine).

Most electricity begins its life with fossil fuels, with the exception of solar, hydro, nuclear or wind produced electricity. So unless your hybrid sprouts a sail, has solar panels on the roof or a mobile nuclear power plant under the hood, it also runs on fossil fuels.

And you should compare fuel economy of a hybrid in real world conditions to a comparable car in real world conditions. You may see those "huge" MPG gains claimed by hybrid marketers shrink. But that's OK, you keep telling yourself that you made a smart decision buying the hybrid. Just don't exepct everyone else to believe it.

OK NoSUV, so at least we agree on one thing; renewable fuel is the best long-term solution.

Unfortunately, electricity, while renewable, is not a viable alternate fuel for use in cars, at least not in its current form. Its disappointing that the best solution marketers have so far is gas powered electric generators in hybrid cars; not a big step forward in reaching a long term solution. Present day hybrids are only marginally better than previous "plug-in to recharge" electric cars of yesteryear. Then, the electricity came from coal-fired power plants, now the gas power plant rides around with the batteries under the hood. This is not rocket science! Hybrids also offer dubious improvements in MPG and effeciency over non-hybrids, and at a high cost. Remember, many non-hybrids match or exceed hybrid MPG and ULEV claims.

Unless, of course you fill that hybrid tank with ethanol or biodissel, now we're talking renewable fuel solutions! But if you burn ethanol or biodiesel, why do you need electricity? Hmmmm, You don't! The internal combustion engine is not a bad concept, it reliably does what we expect it to do, and over 15 million cars with ICEs are sold in North America alone. Our choice of fuel is the critical variable here.

And of course you should maximize ridership in those ethanol burining cars, especially in the HOV-3 lanes (BTW, that stands for High Occupancy Vehicle - 3 passenger minimum)!

Emotional arguments? I think not, this is all very logical and reasonable. But it does not support your claims of hybrid supremacy, so I would expect you to disagree. But the personal attacks are not necessary. Let's stick to the issues!