VA Senate Bill to Expand Tolling Authority

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   Again you go on about slugs should be made to pay for their rides.  What's the problem if they don't?  Oh that's right, you don't like it that a free ride is an incentive to carpool.  Under all circumstances, carpooling leads to less congestion than if each carpooler drove a SOV hybrid.  Save us your talk again about saying the hybrids use less oil/pollute less. We've heard it too many times.  The most pressing concern in this region is traffic congestion, NOT oil consumption/pollution.  Because of that, we need to deal with the problem of traffic first.  Yes, mass transit does help if it exists.  Carpooling helps too!  Is mass transit better?  From a sheer moving people per vehicle standpoint, yes.  However, in this world we live in, people often need to get from pt a to b quickly and at all times of day.  Mass transit does not help with that concern.  Can I take the train or bus from DC at 9 at night to my home in VA?  NO!  Can I get from the pentagon to ft belvoir by train?  NO!  Can I get there by bus?  Sure, but you waste too much of your day sitting on the bus or you have totally missed your appointment.  Because of this, so many people MUST drive because mass transit just won't work for them.  

	It's ignorant to think that there aren't slugs who commute this way because it's cheaper.  However, for so many slugs, this is the most efficient way to get to and from work.  Cars leave continuously at most lots during the HOV hours, and drop off points/pickup points are often much more accessible than other mass transit locations.  It's an added bonus that the ride's free.  If you want more people to use mass transit, you need to make it cost effective for the riders, make it funded, make it accessible at all times of the day, and make it efficient.  And you know what, it's a really hard problem to solve.

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darkprime Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Location: VA Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote darkprime Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 16 Jan 2007 at 12:39pm
	Again you go on about slugs should be made to pay for their rides. What's the problem if they don't? Oh that's right, you don't like it that a free ride is an incentive to carpool. Under all circumstances, carpooling leads to less congestion than if each carpooler drove a SOV hybrid. Save us your talk again about saying the hybrids use less oil/pollute less. We've heard it too many times. The most pressing concern in this region is traffic congestion, NOT oil consumption/pollution. Because of that, we need to deal with the problem of traffic first. Yes, mass transit does help if it exists. Carpooling helps too! Is mass transit better? From a sheer moving people per vehicle standpoint, yes. However, in this world we live in, people often need to get from pt a to b quickly and at all times of day. Mass transit does not help with that concern. Can I take the train or bus from DC at 9 at night to my home in VA? NO! Can I get from the pentagon to ft belvoir by train? NO! Can I get there by bus? Sure, but you waste too much of your day sitting on the bus or you have totally missed your appointment. Because of this, so many people MUST drive because mass transit just won't work for them. It's ignorant to think that there aren't slugs who commute this way because it's cheaper. However, for so many slugs, this is the most efficient way to get to and from work. Cars leave continuously at most lots during the HOV hours, and drop off points/pickup points are often much more accessible than other mass transit locations. It's an added bonus that the ride's free. If you want more people to use mass transit, you need to make it cost effective for the riders, make it funded, make it accessible at all times of the day, and make it efficient. And you know what, it's a really hard problem to solve.

darkprime Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Location: VA Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote darkprime Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 17 Jan 2007 at 7:47am
	Apparently you still can't read. You always tell people to re-read what you write, well it's time you do the same. I never said the slug system solves everything. Stop putting words in others' mouth. You are the one who keeps going back and forth between global warming, traffic, and taxes over and over again whenever someone shows how retarded your arguments are.

SpongeBob Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Location: VA Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote SpongeBob Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 17 Jan 2007 at 12:11pm
	Can I answer first, please please please teacher????? Gee, it's such a difficult and tricky question... and it bears such a direct relation to climate change and gosh, I just don't know what to say! Please, Mr. NoSUV, can you enlighten us with your clever wisdomliness and give us the answer to your ever-so-tricky riddle?

n/a Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 17 Dec 2001 Location: VA Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote n/a Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 17 Jan 2007 at 3:48pm
	Unless there is a viable (reliable, affordable, convenient, clean and comfortable) mass transit system slugs and carpoolers have no incentive to change. And why should we? What we have (carpooling) is economically/traffic/ecologically friendly and, oh by the way, its voluntary. So anyone who wants to switch can. Algae? What in blazes are you talking about?

N_or_S_bound Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 20 May 2005 Location: VA Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote N_or_S_bound Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 Jan 2007 at 9:55am
	quote: Originally posted by raymond [br] Algae? What in blazes are you talking about? It's an old debate move. When you don't have a solid argument supported with facts, avert and/or obfuscate. Hybrids are part of the solution ONLY when they are HOV-compliant. That is the only time they aren't part of the problem. It's simple math. Which would you rather have on the road: 1,000,000 SOV hybrids or 333,333.333 HOV vehicles? My Avalon just turned over to 130K miles. I think it's got another 200K left in it. Maybe they'll come out with a retrofit kit so I can convert it to hybrid technology, ya think? NoSb SOV because you can, HOV because you care!

litaru Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 15 Dec 2006 Location: VA Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote litaru Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 18 Jan 2007 at 11:25am
	I'm curious about the lake riddle, too. Can someone answer soon, I have to leave town and really would not wake up in the middle of the night when I finally get the answer. As for the whole debate...necessity begat invention. NoVA commuter traffic was/is horrendous and enterprising people came up with a solution. There were no tolls or private highways that encouraged an alternate method of commuting to/from DC. I realize it sounds passive /aggressive; but no matter what the Senate elects on the HOV issue, there will be a more pleasant alternative because human nature cannot be legislated. Gonna go google that riddle, now. Take Care...C Ya [;)] M

n/a Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 17 Dec 2001 Location: VA Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote n/a Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2007 at 9:53am
	The question on the table is, should gas taxes pay for road improvements/maintenence, or should tolls? Both are user taxes. The assumption that a gas tax disproportionately burdens locals is only true if the tax is levied only in local NOVA jurisdictions. In addition, tolls burden local users even though NOVA has been tax subsidizing SOVA's transportation needs for years, decades maybe. Then why shouldn't future gas taxes supporting NOVA road improvements be levied statewide? That way all Virginians, as well as thru traffic that stops for in-state fill-ups, will pay to support the state roadways. It seems unreasonable for SOVA/Richmond to object as they have been beneficiaries of NOVA's tax base for so long. Fair's fair!

darkprime Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 05 Jul 2006 Location: VA Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote darkprime Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2007 at 10:58am
	Gas taxes are probably the best way to go as it best distributes the cost state wide.

NoSUV Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 14 Jan 2005 Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote NoSUV Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2007 at 11:26am
	With tolls, the vehicle that is on THAT ROAD, pays for THAT ROAD.

N_or_S_bound Members Profile Find Members Posts New Slug Joined: 20 May 2005 Location: VA Status: Offline Points: 0	Post Options Post Reply Quote N_or_S_bound Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Jan 2007 at 11:47am
	quote: Originally posted by NoSUV [br]With tolls, the vehicle that is on THAT ROAD, pays for THAT ROAD. Really? How does one go about putting into place an accounting method to track just what funds are collected, then reallocated back to THAT ROAD? That comment is such a utopian view and takes in little to none of the realities that exist when it comes to how things really work. Who paid for the roads they're going to start collecting tolls on (e.g. HOT)? NoSb SOV because you can, HOV because you care!