HOV Enforcement
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Topic: HOV Enforcement
Posted By: Oosik
Subject: HOV Enforcement
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2008 at 8:21am
Due to a job change I have not used HOV or slugging as of late. However, I have noticed that while driving by the Springfield HOV exit in the morning that the police are now routinely there on the off ramp to catch the scofflaws who abuse the HOV system. It is not that uncommon to see three or four vehicles stacked up waiting for their ticket or to even have a flatbed picking up a vehicle. Most of the drivers appear to be upset -- at the police, not at their stupidity for driving on HOV in violation of the rules but then I am speculating.
Has there been ANY enforcement at the Pentagon exit where many violators exit? I think Virginia could probably pay a good portion of their road expenses just by monitoring that exit.
Remember that HOV stands for "High Occupancy Vehicle" not "hybrid occupied vehicle." It will be a better day when the hybrids are off the HOV and either transporting slugs or in the stop and go traffic that actually makes their vehicle more fuel efficient.
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Replies:
Posted By: slugcarrier
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2008 at 9:32am
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They have done it before, but it has been 2-3 years. I prefer they not do it there. The problem is there is very little shoulder at the exit ramp, and zero room at the bottom. It backs exit ramp traffic all the way back to Shirlinton. More trouble than benefit.
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Posted By: NoSUV
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2008 at 2:18pm
quote:
Originally posted by Oosik
Remember that HOV stands for "High Occupancy Vehicle" not "hybrid occupied vehicle." It will be a better day when the hybrids are off the HOV and either transporting slugs or in the stop and go traffic that actually makes their vehicle more fuel efficient.
It will be a MUCH better day if/when the HOV lanes stand for Hybrid Only Vehicle - and mass transit. IF the lanes were labled such:
- The region air quality would be improved by 30%
- The demand for gas would drop significantly (Montgomery County switched about 50% of their fleet to hybrids and realized gas savings over over 1/3 from those hybrids, even though they had slightly more mileage)
The BEST day is when slugging is outlawed and commuters stop stealing from the transportation fund, as well as remove vehicles from the trasportation grid.
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Posted By: n/a
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2008 at 3:17pm
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The troll emerges from hibernation! When those like NoSUV/YesSOV decide to fill those empty seats, many of these problems will improve. Fill those seats or practice what you preach and ride a bus!
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Posted By: bnvus
Date Posted: 24 Oct 2008 at 3:42pm
quote:
Originally posted by NoSUV
quote:
Originally posted by Oosik
Remember that HOV stands for "High Occupancy Vehicle" not "hybrid occupied vehicle." It will be a better day when the hybrids are off the HOV and either transporting slugs or in the stop and go traffic that actually makes their vehicle more fuel efficient.
It will be a MUCH better day if/when the HOV lanes stand for Hybrid Only Vehicle - and mass transit. IF the lanes were labled such:
- The region air quality would be improved by 30%
- The demand for gas would drop significantly (Montgomery County switched about 50% of their fleet to hybrids and realized gas savings over over 1/3 from those hybrids, even though they had slightly more mileage)
The BEST day is when slugging is outlawed and commuters stop stealing from the transportation fund, as well as remove vehicles from the trasportation grid.
Whatever...
It will be better when you single Hybrid drivers finally adhere to HIGH Occupancy rules like Mass transit.
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Posted By: mpatoka
Date Posted: 27 Oct 2008 at 12:09pm
Oosik,
I'm always surprised at the number of drivers getting stopped daily at the Springfield exit. They've had enforcement there almost daily for how many years now. The same with the Dale City morning on-ramp. Like slugcarrier said, I haven't seen it enforced in quite some time either and attribute it just to the traffic flow there. It would be a prime location to pick up cheaters. I think the last time I saw someone there, they were making sure people didn't turn it into a 2-lane left turn and made people turn right if you were in the right lane.
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Posted By: sLugLiFe
Date Posted: 27 Oct 2008 at 3:05pm
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About time the trolls came out from hibernation. Here trolli trolli....
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Posted By: Leatherneck
Date Posted: 29 Oct 2008 at 6:59pm
I haven't posted in a while, but I see the troll is still here pushing his stupid memes.
A checkpoint at the Pentagon would be a disaster! We always have to fight the buses that block the intersection, the people who don't know what a stop sign means, and the clueless who don't understand that it's a two-lane exit ramp. Please don't encourage Virginia's finest to check HOV abusers at the Pentagon!
TC
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Posted By: toomuchcoffeelady
Date Posted: 06 Nov 2008 at 10:54am
quote:
Originally posted by NoSUVThe BEST day is when slugging is outlawed and commuters stop stealing from the transportation fund, as well as remove vehicles from the trasportation grid.
Still not grasping the whole "this is a free market/free country and people have the right to commute any way they choose" I see....
It will be a better day when you take your ridiculous accusations against us sluggers (how the F are we stealing) and cram them.
ain't free speech a wonderful thing, until you don't like the views being stated? - Ceejay2
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Posted By: Pele
Date Posted: 10 Nov 2008 at 9:12pm
Well, we have speed cameras and red light cameras...
I propose HOV cameras.
Think about this:
How long are HOV lanes in effect?
6-9 AM and 3-6 PM... That's six hours.
Set up cameras on flyovers, bridges, sign scaffolding, and other overhead HOV structures.
Pay someone to watch the video and see if the proper Clean Fuel tags are displayed or if there are the correct number of occupants in the vehicle... If not, pause the video, run plates, and mail ticket... Simple as that.
I'm pretty sure that not only will this video watcher's salary get paid, but the revenue will increase tenfold or violations will disappear almost completely.
Now, how to punish those pulled over for riding singleton in the HOV lanes...
My first idea was to shoot them... But a corpse can't pay for the fine, nor can a corpse be converted to a slug driver the following day...
The better solution is to take the keys from them.
When can they get them back?
When it's legal to drive single again. If you get caught at 8:50 AM going north or 5:50 PM going south, no biggie... If you've gotten caught right at the beginning of HOV, you better call and say you're going to be late.
Obviously they have to pay the fine to get their keys back. The revenue goes to the transportation fund.
If they leave the car unattended there and go to work via another means, the car gets towed and impounded and there's more revenue for the state.
All funds go to double decking I-95 between Dumfries and the 14th street bridge... Four lanes on the ground, four lanes above for eight lanes in each direction...
Or just extending MetroRail to Dumfries, that'll work too.
Who's with me? Elect me for state transportation budget czar...
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Posted By: CJ
Date Posted: 11 Nov 2008 at 12:06pm
First let me say I have never cheated on the HOV lanes-a 50 dollar fine and having to watch people laughing as they drive by is enough incentive for me. While I do see one or two cheaters everyday, I think taking people's keys away is a bit much. How do you know that the person who was driving single didn't just get a call saying their kid was sick and needed to be taken to the doctor immediately (I do know someone this happened to) or wasn't just notified of a death in the family and therefore decided the 50 dollar fine was worth the extra hour sitting in traffic. Jeesh people why don't we just hang people from the exit signs......after we get their credit card to pay for the fine of course...
CJ
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Posted By: Pele
Date Posted: 12 Nov 2008 at 5:34am
^
Well in that case, maybe a court case is warranted and the fine will be low if a death certificate or doctors notice is provided... If not, fine them for perjury or obstruction of justice as well.
As stated before, killing the offenders removes a good revenue stream.
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Posted By: NoSUV
Date Posted: 12 Nov 2008 at 12:23pm
quote:
Originally posted by toomuchcoffeelady
quote:
Originally posted by NoSUVThe BEST day is when slugging is outlawed and commuters stop stealing from the transportation fund, as well as remove vehicles from the trasportation grid.
Still not grasping the whole "this is a free market/free country and people have the right to commute any way they choose" I see....
It will be a better day when you take your ridiculous accusations against us sluggers (how the F are we stealing) and cram them.
ain't free speech a wonderful thing, until you don't like the views being stated? - Ceejay2
Interesting quote at the bottom of you post - I guess you think that only applies to you?
It's been often quoted, and the Wash Post 11/10 article also states it, that the term "slug" for this region came about because drivers were stealing passengers that were planning on taking the bus.
Once again, for those of you who haven't had enough coffee, HOV-40 is FAR better than HOV-3.
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Posted By: CJ
Date Posted: 12 Nov 2008 at 3:39pm
I tried taking the bus for about three months this summer. It added over an hour to my commute. Busses aren't synced up with Metro so i would get to the Pentagon at 5:18 am and the next yellow line doesn't come for like 15 minutes,then get to L'Enfant only to find that I just missed the green and have to wait another 10 for that one. Basically I left my house at 4:40 am and got to work at almost 6 am. Driving, I'm there by 5:20. No thanks on the HOV 40. Been there done that. I'll plant a tree to make up for my carbon footprint--that's what Al Gore does!
CJ
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Posted By: n/a
Date Posted: 13 Nov 2008 at 4:25pm
Interesting quote at the bottom of you post - I guess you think that only applies to you?
It's been often quoted, and the Wash Post 11/10 article also states it, that the term "slug" for this region came about because drivers were stealing passengers that were planning on taking the bus.
Once again, for those of you who haven't had enough coffee, HOV-40 is FAR better than HOV-3.
NoSUV should try HOV-something, HOV-anything! HOV in any vehicle is better than SOV-hybrid; HOV-3 hybrid is far better than your current anti-HOV commute! Turn your car into a mini-bus by driveing HOV-hybrid and put me to shame! I'll shut up now if you do! HOV NOW or ride the bus!
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Posted By: getmehome pweeze
Date Posted: 14 Nov 2008 at 8:34am
Oh lordy- this is an argument that will never end. I HOV-3 in the AM, and HOV-40 in the PM... I guess I should plant 1/2 a tree? Maybe a shrub...
Anyone see "The Happening"? According to Mark Walberg, the plants are out to get us anyway. We should say hello to their mothers...
Slug'n till 2013 (when the HOT lanes roll in)
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Posted By: toomuchcoffeelady
Date Posted: 14 Nov 2008 at 3:53pm
quote:
Originally posted by NoSUV
ain't free speech a wonderful thing, until you don't like the views being stated? - Ceejay2
Interesting quote at the bottom of you post - I guess you think that only applies to you?
Couldn't the same be said for you too, dearie?
quote:
It's been often quoted, and the Wash Post 11/10 article also states it, that the term "slug" for this region came about because drivers were stealing passengers that were planning on taking the bus.
Show me where it says "steal". Please. Someone choosing a carpool over an over-priced, slow as molasses bus isn't stealing, merely exercising their rights in a free market economy.
You know what free speech does exclude though are libel and defamation of character. You putting it in writing, especially repeatedly, that slugs are theives, stealing, etc, is just that.
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Posted By: Oosik
Date Posted: 18 Nov 2008 at 3:22pm
This morning I saw five scofflaws cooling their heels at the Springfield HOV exit shortly before 9 a.m. as the police were taking their time to write tickets. What a wonderful thing to see as I inched along on I-95 as HOV cheaters were finally being held accountable. [:D][:D][:D] No doubt they thought they were safe since it was so close to opening up High Occupancy Vehicle lanes to everyone. Another car was getting a ticket near the HOV entrance by Edsall Road -- Here I suspect the driver was parking on the shoulder waiting for HOV to open. [:D]
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Posted By: RVDUSA
Date Posted: 20 Nov 2008 at 9:08am
In a 23 OCT post by NOSUV (the troll to some) he submits that by changing the HOV from High Occupancy Vehicle to Hybrid Only Vehicles the region would see a 30% air quality improvement and obtain a significant drop on gasoline demand. I find this statement categorically flawed.
My experience indicates that Hybrid only cars in the HOV lane "typically" has only one driver and no passengers. So to make the HOV lanes Hybrid Only would simply increase the number of cars on the road and conversely reduce the number of riders per car. This would mean that there are now two hybrids on the road to what would otherwise be two riders under the current system. This would certainly negate the air quality issue noted by Mr. SUV and increase per capita consumption rates by 33% which is 66% cumulatively in a Hybrid only system.
Of note in this analysis is the fact that China stands out as a developing country that is also seeking to increase per capita consumption rates. China as you know has the world’s fastest growing economy, and there are 1.3 billion Chinese, four times the United States population. I think Mr. SUV that you recognize that the world is already running out of resources, and it will do so even sooner if China achieves American-level consumption rates. Already, China is competing with us for oil and metals on world markets.
Recognizing that per capita consumption rates in China are still about 11 times below ours, I offer for your consideration the possibility that China's consumption rates will rise to our levels in the very near future. In this scenario also imagine that nothing else occurs to increase overall world consumption — that is, no other country increases its consumption, all national populations (including China’s) remain unchanged; and immigration ceases. Given these facts China’s growth is roughly doubling the world’s consumption rates. At this rate Oil consumption will increase by 106 percent, for instance, and world metal consumption by 94 percent.
Therefore to propose a Hybrid only lane only serves to increase our own consumption rates by 66%. With China and you increasing per capita consumption rates by such astronomical proportions my only recourse is to submit that - if we were to change the HOV to Hybrid only we risk a strategic confrontation with China for natural resources.
Now do we really want to risk war with China for a Hybrid only lane? [:D]
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Posted By: jomac006
Date Posted: 20 Nov 2008 at 9:45am
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Yes Hybrids are nice for city driving because they run off of the electric battery there (which are very toxic and bad for the enviroment when they die and they will in less then ten years, but who cares you're saving gas now so you can be smug), however when on the hwy and HOV lanes doing 55-65 they run off their internal combustion engine using gas and getting a similar mpg as my Corolla, so you see turning the HOV into a Hybrid only lane wouldn't help at all it would hurt when you slam all those other drivers onto the regular lanes crawling at a snails pace and wasting gas which emits more CO2 into the air and polluting more. So take your toxic car and your smug attitude and leave the rest of us alone. In fact I my take my gas saving car and trade it in for a Hummer just to spite you, and while I'm at it I'll go home today and stand outside just spraying aerosol cans into the air.
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Posted By: NoSUV
Date Posted: 21 Nov 2008 at 10:36am
RVDUSA and jomac006, both of you have basic flaws in your discussion.
RV - you have overlooked several economic issues, chiefly supply and demand. Back when the express lanes were for buses only (hybrids did not exist), 40% of the cars were taken off of the road. What would happen if all slugs "went back" to taking the bus? And the alterative, using a hybrid for the "hybrid only lanes," would mean that ALL miles used by that vehicle, not just those for the commute, would use less gas and pollute less.
jomac - it's too bad that you are ignorant on how a hybrid works, and that you are either using a gut feel or getting your information from sources that also have no idea. Unless you floor the accelerator the entire time, the battery provides assistance to the internal combustion engine. It's rarely if ever only one or the other -- that's why they call it a hybrid.
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Posted By: jomac006
Date Posted: 25 Nov 2008 at 10:39am
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NOSUV, I like how you brought up only a single flaw in my argument. Once you reach 65 sure the car may run off both engines but to get up to 65 you have to floor it and it takes a while for a Hybrid to get up to 65, so you are using a lot of gas just to do that. Second I like how you ignored the fact that the engine is a toxic also if you don't allow 3 people cars into the HOV lane how crowded the streets are going to be, and don't tell me that Hybrid drivers with carpool or pick up slugs. I saw 6 Priuses on the road this morning and all 6 had only the driver in them. No matter what you say 2 SUVs with 3 people in each is better for the environment then 6 Hybrids with only the driver in them. So take your Holier than Thou attitude somewhere else, because those of us slugging are reducing our carbon footprint a lot more than you and those who drive only themselves to work in their hybrids.
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Posted By: NoSUV
Date Posted: 28 Nov 2008 at 6:21pm
quote:
Originally posted by jomac006
NOSUV, I like how you brought up only a single flaw in my argument. Once you reach 65 sure the car may run off both engines but to get up to 65 you have to floor it and it takes a while for a Hybrid to get up to 65, so you are using a lot of gas just to do that. Second I like how you ignored the fact that the engine is a toxic also if you don't allow 3 people cars into the HOV lane how crowded the streets are going to be, and don't tell me that Hybrid drivers with carpool or pick up slugs. I saw 6 Priuses on the road this morning and all 6 had only the driver in them. No matter what you say 2 SUVs with 3 people in each is better for the environment then 6 Hybrids with only the driver in them. So take your Holier than Thou attitude somewhere else, because those of us slugging are reducing our carbon footprint a lot more than you and those who drive only themselves to work in their hybrids.
You are still wrong. Check the pollution figures. SUVs need to be HOV-8 to make up for a SOV hybrid. As most informed people can tell you, the hybrid exemption is NOT for fuel eficiency. It's not a Holy than Thou attitude - it's merely the facts. You are NOT reducing your carbon footprint unless you are on a bus or in a hybrid.
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Posted By: CJ
Date Posted: 30 Nov 2008 at 10:52am
My main concern is not having to sit in traffic for 4 hours a day, which is what would happen if we went and all drove hybrids but didn't carpool. Since Al Gore says planting a tree elimates his use of a private jet carbon footprint, I figure if I plant a couple trees I'm good until I retire.
CJ
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Posted By: PickEmUpAndBringEmHome
Date Posted: 30 Nov 2008 at 11:40am
Yeah, but then the housing developers will just chop them down to make room for more townhouses which will add more commuters to the road which means more trees, more chopping, more commuter, etc ..
On a more serious note, while I do care about the environment and believe that we all have to do our part (turn off lights, turn down the HVAC and turn on the ceiling fan, etc), the one and ONLY reason I pick up slugs in my Northstar V8 Cadillac is purely to cut down on my time to and from the office. I pickemupandbringemhome when it is convienient for me and to cut down on my commute.
Selfish? Absolutely! ... and that is the one and only reason the system works as well as it does ...
The Green Party, Al Gore, NoSUV, the Sierra Club, and Earth First! can all kiss my tail pipe, but no matter the politics, if they are standing in line when I pull up and call out 2 for X, Y, or Z location ... they are welcome to hop in and enjoy the ride.
FKA Atlantis.99
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