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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote marchf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Booting hybrids from carpool lanes slows all
    Posted: 27 Nov 2014 at 11:20am

Instead of Buicks, how about veterans who are fed employees. Or how about just giving me a special pass? Under the hybrid logic, folks are paying for the HOV privilege, but the car dealer is the one who wins.


quote:
Originally posted by Dale H

So, it appears the slow down was caused by a large number of hybrid drivers using the normal lanes instead of picking up riders. I suppose we are expected to conclude that it is advantageous to all of us to continue to let single passenger hybrids use the HOV lanes.

If the HOV lanes are underutilized, any strategy that shifts a controlled number of cars from the normal lanes to the HOV lanes should improve traffic flow. There is nothing special about hybrids. It makes just as much sense to allow Buick drivers to use the HOV lanes. We could have "Toyota Thursdays" where everyone with a Toyota is allowed in the HOV lanes, then "Ford Fridays". Or anyone whose license number ends in a "5" gets to use the HOV lanes on Wednesdays.

No, I am not serious, but my point is there is nothing special about hybrids.

Dale H

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NoSUV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Mar 2013 at 12:22pm
quote:
Originally posted by colossus911

Yep, Journal of Industrial Ecology report from the WSJ. More carbon emissions than gas. Facts are tough things.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324128504578346913994914472.html?mod=rss_opinion_main


Looks like you forgot to read the article, and its assumptions - not facts. It makes assumptions about the manufacture that are not proven, it makes assumptions that are just wrong about the life of component parts, and it makes assumptions that seem unlikely about the total mileage of the vehicle before it is scrapped.

Yep - you are wrong AGAIN.

BTW, my 2002 Prius is still on the original battery, and has 3x the mileage quoted in the article. Try again when you have FACTS.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote colossus911 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11 Mar 2013 at 10:37am
Yep, Journal of Industrial Ecology report from the WSJ. More carbon emissions than gas. Facts are tough things.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324128504578346913994914472.html?mod=rss_opinion_main
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote grucker Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Mar 2013 at 3:59pm
Actually, your both wrong, they need to change their break pads LESS frequently. All diesel trains are hybrids that use regenerative breaking (ie, "hybrid breaking") even though they don't have energy storage BECAUSE it is easier on the breaks. They actually just dissipate the energy produced from regenerative breaking using giant resistors.

Think about it, there are only two places the kinetic energy can go when a car slows down. When it uses break pads, all of it goes into rubbing against and heating the break pads which slowly kills them. When a car uses regenerative breaking, the energy goes through a generator into a battery and puts no wear on the break pads.

There's not much difference though for hybrid cars b/c most of the wear on break pads comes from quick stops, which hybrid cars still use break pads for.

But how are Hybrids on Brake Pads? [:)]
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote realquick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Mar 2013 at 4:06am
quote:
Originally posted by ETC

This is probably a better article about hybrid impact:

http://greatergreaterwashington.org/post/9298/whos-causing-congestion-on-i-66-hybrids-or-scofflaws/


Are you kidding? This article doesn't address any of the issues raised in the LA times article. This is the only useful piece of information in this article:

One person in a single location on a single day observed that 20% of the vehicles using the HOV road were hybrids. The average speed in the HOV was 30 - 40 mph, which was slower than free flowing(although he doesn't say by how much).

Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting that the LA study should be applied to DC, but at least the article is based on a real study.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote realquick Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Mar 2013 at 3:46am
quote:
Originally posted by NoSUV

quote:
Originally posted by ETC

Hybrid owners will not be keeping their cars to 100,000 miles. They'll be trading it in before the hybrid battery expires to avoid the $3000 replacement cost.

Also the hybrids have two batteries: the regular car battery and the rechargeable one. And they have to change their brake pads more frequently because of the charging method.


...
There is no difference in the brake pad wear from a non-hybrid vehicle.
...


quote:
Originally posted by ETC

And they have to change their brake pads more frequently because of the charging method.


Actually, your both wrong, they need to change their break pads LESS frequently. All diesel trains are hybrids that use regenerative breaking (ie, "hybrid breaking") even though they don't have energy storage BECAUSE it is easier on the breaks. They actually just dissipate the energy produced from regenerative breaking using giant resistors.

Think about it, there are only two places the kinetic energy can go when a car slows down. When it uses break pads, all of it goes into rubbing against and heating the break pads which slowly kills them. When a car uses regenerative breaking, the energy goes through a generator into a battery and puts no wear on the break pads.

There's not much difference though for hybrid cars b/c most of the wear on break pads comes from quick stops, which hybrid cars still use break pads for.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Pele Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Nov 2011 at 2:26pm
quote:
Originally posted by NoSUV


Pele - previously asked and answered. Your concerns have been proved bogus.



Where?

-------------------------
Times to beat:
Horner Rd to/from Pentagon: 12 mins Without Slugs - 17 mins With slugs
Dale City exit to/from 3rd St Tunnel, D.C. 18 mins (No slugs - Holiday)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Dale H Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Nov 2011 at 1:04pm
quote:
Quite wrong.


In the context of the article you posted, which dealt with commuting times and not pollution, my comments are Quite Correct.

If you want to talk about pollution we can, of course.

quote:
And, as you are also likely aware, hybrids have about 20% of the pollution as conventional vehicles


My understanding is that the 20% number was calculating assuming a mix of city and highway driving. The HOV lanes do not present such a mix. It is all highway.

I went to www.fueleconomy.gov to see how comparable cars compare in highway gas milage between hybrid and conventional models. According to them, a conventional 2011 Camry with a 2,5 liter 4 cylinder engine and automatic transmission gets 32 mpg. A hybrid Camry with 2.4 liter 4 cylinder engine and automatic transmission gets 35 mpg, or 9.375% more. I am not sure exactly how mpg relates to emmisions, but I am certain that a 9.375% increase in gas milage does not translate into an 80% reduction in emissions. I am equally certain, based on these numbers, that a single occupant hybrid does not produce less pollution per occupant than a comparable conventional vehicle with three occupants.

Dale H
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NoSUV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Nov 2011 at 9:16am
quote:
Originally posted by ETC

Hybrid owners will not be keeping their cars to 100,000 miles. They'll be trading it in before the hybrid battery expires to avoid the $3000 replacement cost.

Also the hybrids have two batteries: the regular car battery and the rechargeable one. And they have to change their brake pads more frequently because of the charging method.


Not all of this is true. I've had my hybrid for 140K and have yet to replace the hybrid battery. Can you say the same for your regular battery?

There is no difference in the brake pad wear from a non-hybrid vehicle.

But you are correct in that there are 2 batteries.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote NoSUV Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Nov 2011 at 9:13am
quote:
Originally posted by Pele

quote:
Originally posted by NoSUV

And, as you are also likely aware, hybrids have about 20% of the pollution as conventional vehicles (sedan to sedan; if you compare to SUV's, the hybrids have a MUCH better advantage).



You factoring in the fuel is cost to run the equipment at the strip mine where they dug up the Nickel for your NiMH battery packs?

How about the cargo ship that moved the nickel from Canada to Japan for battery pack manufacturing?

Also, have you factored in the replacement battery pack? Both my Honda CRX and Ford pickup are from the late 80's with over 300,000 miles on them each... I guarantee you'll go through at least two battery packs in 20 years.

Carbon footprint envy is BS.

-------------------------
Times to beat:
Horner Rd to/from Pentagon: 12 mins Without Slugs - 17 mins With slugs
Dale City exit to/from 3rd St Tunnel, D.C. 18 mins (No slugs - Holiday)


Pele - previously asked and answered. Your concerns have been proved bogus.
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